Comment from Ronald John Bartle on the article Does Electoral Politics Fit Democracy?: Germany's cuts in social services raise questions about the nature of government Ronda Hauben writes with some examples of govt. actions in UK/USA - Germany that were at odds with "many of the populace." If in the examples yshe quotes (opposition to Iraq war and to reductions in welfare provision in Germany-) this was actually the govt's going against the will of "many-" in the population - that would have been bad enough- but that is a well know and inherent problem in parliamentary democracy - at best the govt'ss promise to act in the interests of the whole population but in fact only have a mandate from part of the population (that voted for them.) On the other hand in the instances you refer to, if I am not mistaken - it was in fact more that the govt's in fact flew in the face of a *majority* of the population - ignoring thier expressed wishes, and deciding the opposite case. (In the UK/USA going for an unpopular war on false pretensions - in the case of Germany pushing thru a welfare reform against the will of the majority of the populace.) While decisions that displease "many" are inherent in the concept of a parliamentary democracy - here one sees scandalous dishonesty when the elected representatives go against the known will of thier voters. Others will claim that the voters do not vote for a particular political line, but more exactly defined for a group of political actors who they then abandon thier fate too - until the next election. In Germany there is a mechanism called the "Volksbegehren" which in certain narrowly- defined circumstances gives the populace (more precisely - the voters ) a limited chance to intervene when enough voters join together to express thier opposition to the current governments conduct... in a similar way in the USA there is the possibility of an Impeachment. The limititations of these provisions are (like the "Devil-") in the details. While day - for - day hundreds of articles relating to the topic alt.impeach.bush are posted on the uucp-news (Usenet) discussion group in the Internet on this topic - there is almost no mention of it in the mainstream US press/media. The details of how exactly the "Volksbegehren" system in Germany works means that in practice it has little relevance to major political decisions of the government at federal level. At the same time there is, especially here in Germany an even more worrying aspect to the practical implications of a parliamentary democracy. We need to remember that in Weimar (Florida?) a manipulated "democratic" majority can vote in a regime that turns out later to be either fascist or with attributes that some would consider to be quite fascistic. The result is that millions suffer for years and years until only with enormous travail the mistake can be reversed. OK - like most of us - I also find it easier to bring attention to failures and problems - it is another mater to find the soloutions or even suggest them. Until one has defind the problem - the search for a soloution can't really begin though. ron b.